Legislature(1993 - 1994)

02/11/1994 08:15 AM House RES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
                                                                               
               HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                              
                        February 11, 1994                                      
                            8:15 a.m.                                          
                                                                               
                                                                               
  MEMBERS PRESENT                                                              
                                                                               
  Representative Bill Williams, Chairman                                       
  Representative Bill Hudson, Vice Chairman                                    
  Representative Con Bunde                                                     
  Representative David Finkelstein                                             
  Representative Joe Green                                                     
                                                                               
  MEMBERS ABSENT                                                               
                                                                               
  Representative Pat Carney                                                    
  Representative John Davies                                                   
  Representative Jeannette James                                               
  Representative Eldon Mulder                                                  
                                                                               
  OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT                                                    
                                                                               
  Representative Gail Phillips                                                 
  Senator Robin Taylor                                                         
                                                                               
                                                                               
  COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                           
                                                                               
  SB 153:  "An Act relating to the exchange of certain fish                    
            for seafood products, custom processing of certain                 
            fish, and use of certain fish for charitable                       
            purposes."                                                         
                                                                               
            MOVED CSSB 153(RES)am WITH TWO FISCAL NOTES FROM                   
            COMMITTEE WITH INDIVIDUAL RECOMMENDATIONS                          
                                                                               
                                                                               
  WITNESS REGISTER                                                             
                                                                               
  SENATOR ROBIN TAYLOR                                                         
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  State Capitol, Room 30                                                       
  Juneau, Alaska   99801-1182                                                  
  Phone:  465-3873                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Prime sponsor SB 153                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE GAIL PHILLIPS                                                 
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  State Capitol, Room 216                                                      
  Juneau, Alaska   99801-1182                                                  
  Phone:  465-2689                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported SB 153 and opposed K.3                        
                       amendment                                               
                                                                               
  LEE PUTNAM, Vice President                                                   
  Ketchikan Sports & Wildlife Club                                             
  6005 Roosevelt Drive                                                         
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-7694                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  GARY PLUMB                                                                   
  441 Hillcrest Avenue                                                         
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-6409                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  MATT DONOHOE                                                                 
  P.O. Box 2993                                                                
  Sitka, Alaska   99835                                                        
  Phone:  747-6467                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  WAYNE CARPENTER                                                              
  P.O. Box 954                                                                 
  Seward, Alaska   99664                                                       
  Phone:  224-3796                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  THEODORE JOHNSON                                                             
  347 Riverside Drive                                                          
  Soldotna, Alaska   99669                                                     
  Phone:  262-5456                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  PAUL GOEDERT                                                                 
  Deep Creek Charters                                                          
  P.O. Box 39415                                                               
  Ninilchik, Alaska   99639                                                    
  Phone:  567-3665                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  SEAN MARTIN                                                                  
  Homer Charter Association                                                    
  P.O. Box 889                                                                 
  Homer, Alaska   99603                                                        
  Phone:  235-5130                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  DENNIS PEIRE                                                                 
  Valdez Charter Association                                                   
  P.O. Box 55675                                                               
  North Pole, Alaska   99714                                                   
  Phone:  488-4589                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  BUZZ OTIS                                                                    
  P.O. Box 72441                                                               
  Fairbanks, Alaska   99707                                                    
  Phone:  452-5617                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  RICHARD ANDREW                                                               
  P.O. Box 7211                                                                
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-2463                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  ROBERT HUGHES                                                                
  3833 Denali                                                                  
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-0274                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported SB 153 and K.3 amendment                      
                                                                               
  DAVID BRAY                                                                   
  2729 Tongass                                                                 
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-3505                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  ERIC MUENCH                                                                  
  P.O. Box 6811                                                                
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-5372                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  DEAN PADDOCK                                                                 
  P.o. Box 21951                                                               
  Juneau, Alaska   99802                                                       
  Phone:  463-4970                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  RICHARD HOFMANN                                                              
  5025 Thane Road                                                              
  Juneau, Alaska   99801                                                       
  Phone:  586-3451                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  ROBERT WARD                                                                  
  A-Ward Charters                                                              
  P.O. Box 631                                                                 
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-7014                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  JOE AMBROSE, Aide                                                            
  Senator Robin Taylor                                                         
  State Capitol, Room 30                                                       
  Juneau, Alaska   99801-1182                                                  
  Phone:  465-3873                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered questions                                      
                                                                               
  TOM HAGBORG, Member                                                          
  South Peninsula Sportsmen                                                    
  P.O. Box 175                                                                 
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-8139                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  NANCY HILLSTRAND, Owner/Operator                                             
  Coal Point Trading                                                           
  P.O. Box 674                                                                 
  Homer, Alaska   99603                                                        
  Phone:  235-3877                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  RICK CONOVER, President                                                      
  Anchor Point Chamber of Commerce                                             
  P.O. Box 610                                                                 
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-5570                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  DARREL SHREVE                                                                
  Valdez Charter Association                                                   
  P.O. Box 2053                                                                
  Valdez, Alaska   99686                                                       
  Phone:  835-4734                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  DONALD WESTLUND                                                              
  P.O. Box 7583                                                                
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-9319                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed SB 153 and K.3 amendment                        
                                                                               
  ED STAHL                                                                     
  651 Deerberry Court                                                          
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  247-2481                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Made comments                                           
                                                                               
  SCOTT ULMER                                                                  
  P.O. Box 1950                                                                
  Homer, Alaska   99603                                                        
  Phone:  235-8934                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed SB 153 and K.3 amendment                        
                                                                               
  NOEL PUTNAM                                                                  
  846 Brown Deer                                                               
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-0687                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Supported K.3 amendment                                 
                                                                               
  JOE SUYMBERSKY                                                               
  P.O. Box 15322                                                               
  Fritz Creek, Alaska   99603                                                  
  Phone:  235-3465                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed SB 153 & K.3 amendment                          
                                                                               
  ED DERSHAM                                                                   
  Anchor Point Charter Association                                             
  P.O. Box 537                                                                 
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-5555                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment and expressed                     
                       dissatisfaction with teleconference                     
                                                                               
  ROGER WATNEY                                                                 
  P.O. Box 54                                                                  
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-4063                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  KARAN DERSHAM                                                                
  P.O. Box 555                                                                 
  Anchor Point, Alaska   99556                                                 
  Phone:  235-5555                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  JACK MONTGOMERY, Owner/Operator                                              
  Rainbow Tours                                                                
  P.O. box 1526                                                                
  Homer, Alaska   99603                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed K.3 amendment                                   
                                                                               
  DAN MCQUEEN                                                                  
  Ketchikan Marine Charters, Inc.                                              
  322 Tide Avenue                                                              
  Ketchikan, Alaska   99901                                                    
  Phone:  225-2731                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Opposed SB 153 and K.3 amendment                        
                                                                               
  GERALD MASOLINI                                                              
  P.O. Box 1131                                                                
  Cordova, Alaska   99574                                                      
  Phone:  424-7328                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Made comments                                           
                                                                               
  JOHN BURKE, Director                                                         
  Division of Sport Fish                                                       
  Alaska Department of Fish and Game                                           
  P.O. Box 25526                                                               
  Juneau, Alaska   99802                                                       
  Phone:  465-5280                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered questions                                      
                                                                               
  PREVIOUS ACTION                                                              
                                                                               
  BILL:  SB 153                                                                
  SHORT TITLE: EXCHANGE OF RAW FISH FOR SEAFOOD PRODUCT                        
  SPONSOR(S): SENATOR(S) TAYLOR                                                
                                                                               
  JRN-DATE     JRN-PG               ACTION                                     
  03/09/93       691    (S)   READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)                  
  03/09/93       691    (S)   RESOURCES, FINANCE                               
  03/24/93              (S)   RES AT 03:30 PM BUTRVICH RM 205                  
  03/24/93              (S)   MINUTE(RES)                                      
  03/29/93              (S)   RES AT 04:00 PM BUTRVICH RM 205                  
  03/31/93              (S)   MINUTE(RES)                                      
  04/02/93      1063    (S)   RES RPT  CS  1DP 3NR SAME TITLE                  
  04/02/93      1063    (S)   LETTER OF INTENT W/RES REPORT                    
  04/02/93      1063    (S)   FISCAL NOTE TO SB & CS (DEC)                     
  04/02/93      1063    (S)   ZERO FISCAL NOTE (F&G)                           
  04/06/93              (S)   FIN AT 08:00 AM SENATE FIN 518                   
  04/10/93              (S)   FIN AT 10:00 AM SENATE FIN 518                   
  04/12/93      1305    (S)   FIN RPT  3DP 1NR  (RES)CS                        
  04/12/93      1305    (S)   PREVIOUS FN (DEC)                                
  04/12/93      1305    (S)   PREVIOUS ZERO FN (F&G)                           
  04/12/93              (S)   MINUTE(RLS)                                      
  04/27/93      1837    (S)   RULES 3CAL 1NR     4/27/93                       
  04/27/93      1839    (S)   READ THE SECOND TIME                             
  04/27/93      1840    (S)   RES  CS ADOPTED UNAN CONSENT                     
  04/27/93      1841    (S)   ADVANCE TO THIRD READING FAILED                  
                              Y11 N9                                           
  04/27/93      1841    (S)   THIRD READING 4/28 CALENDAR                      
  04/28/93      1890    (S)   READ THE THIRD TIME                              
                              CSSB 153(RES)                                    
  04/28/93      1890    (S)   (S) ADOPTED RES LTR OF INTENT                    
  04/28/93      1890    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 4/29                                         
  04/29/93      1954    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 4/30                                         
  04/30/93      1989    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 5/1                                          
  05/01/93      2016    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 5/2                                          
  05/02/93      2033    (S)   MOVED TO BOTTOM OF CALENDAR                      
  05/02/93      2039    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 5/3                                          
  05/03/93      2049    (S)   HELD IN THIRD READING W/PENDING                  
                              AMS 5/4                                          
  05/04/93      2060    (S)   RETURN TO SECOND FOR AM 1-6                      
                              UNAN CONSENT                                     
  05/04/93      2061    (S)   AM NO  1   FAILED  Y10 N10                       
  05/04/93      2061    (S)   AM NO  2   NOT OFFERED                           
  05/04/93      2062    (S)   AM NO  3   FAILED  Y9 N11                        
  05/04/93      2062    (S)   AM NO  4   MOVED AND WITHDRAWN                   
  05/04/93      2063    (S)   AM NO  4A  ADOPTED UNAN CONSENT                  
  05/04/93      2063    (S)   AM NO  5   ADOPTED UNAN CONSENT                  
  05/04/93      2064    (S)   AM NO  6   FAILED  Y9 N11                        
  05/04/93      2064    (S)   AUTOMATICALLY IN THIRD READING                   
  05/04/93      2064    (S)   PASSED Y17 N3 CSSB 153(RES) AM                   
  05/04/93      2065    (S)   DUNCAN NOTICE OF RECON                           
  05/05/93      2079    (S)   RECONSIDERATION NOT TAKEN UP                     
  05/05/93      2079    (S)   TRANSMITTED TO (H)                               
  05/06/93      1660    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)                  
  05/06/93      1661    (H)   RESOURCES, FINANCE                               
  01/28/94              (H)   RES AT 08:15 AM CAPITOL 124                      
  01/28/94              (H)   MINUTE(RES)                                      
  02/11/94              (H)   RES AT 08:15 AM CAPITOL 124                      
                                                                               
  ACTION NARRATIVE                                                             
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-12, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 000                                                                   
                                                                               
  The House Resources Committee was called to order by                         
  Chairman Bill Williams at 8:20 a.m.  Members present at the                  
  call to order were Representatives Williams, Hudson, Bunde,                  
  Finkelstein, and Green.  Members absent were Representatives                 
  Carney, Davies, James and Mulder.                                            
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN BILL WILLIAMS announced there was a quorum present.                 
  He said the meeting is on teleconference with Ketchikan,                     
  Homer, Kodiak, Mat-Su, Sitka, Kenai/Soldotna, Valdez,                        
  Fairbanks, Seward and Cordova.                                               
  SB 153 EXCHANGE OF RAW FISH FOR SEAFOOD PRODUCT                              
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS informed members SB 153 would be heard.                    
  He said the committee had its first hearing on the bill                      
  about ten days ago and many people did not have the                          
  opportunity to testify at that time.  He hoped to move the                   
  bill out of committee.                                                       
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS stated at the first hearing, a proposed                    
  amendment, draft number K.2 was considered.  The subject of                  
  the amendment was possession limits on sport caught fish and                 
  it was intended to address a concern about whether the Board                 
  of Fisheries needs more clearly defined authority to include                 
  processed fish in possession limits, and to set possession                   
  limits both in the field and in transport.  He said the                      
  amendment generated considerable discussion.                                 
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS announced a slightly revised version of                    
  the amendment, draft amendment K.3 will be considered.  The                  
  difference between the two versions is that under the K.2                    
  amendment, the provisions of SB 153 regarding the exchange                   
  of raw fish would not have gone into effect "unless and                      
  until" the Board of Fisheries took action to address the                     
  inclusion of processed fish in possession limits.                            
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS said under the K.3 amendment, there is no                  
  need for the board to take up the subject of possession                      
  limits in order for the exchange provisions to become                        
  effective.  The K.3 amendment would amend the section of                     
  state statute which lists the things that the Board of                       
  Fisheries may do, including that possession limits may                       
  include processed fish, and that they may establish                          
  possession limits both in the field, and in transit to the                   
  fisherman's permanent place of residence.  Therefore, if the                 
  ability to exchange raw fish for processed fish does create,                 
  or intensify a problem with the quantities of fish being                     
  taken, and at some time in the future, public pressure to                    
  address the problem through possession limits compels the                    
  board to handle the subject, the board will have the                         
  authority to do so.                                                          
                                                                               
  Number 085                                                                   
                                                                               
  SENATOR ROBIN TAYLOR stated that SB 153 is primarily a jobs                  
  enhancement bill, providing additional utilization of                        
  processing facilities throughout the state.  He said the                     
  bill will not damage custom packers because often in the                     
  past they have not followed rules and regulations and if                     
  they did, the bill will help make their job simpler and                      
  easier to do.                                                                
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR remarked SB 153 will help get a count on the                  
  volume of fish resources actually moving out of state                        
  through processing facilities.  To date, no one knows how                    
  much fish is leaving the state.  He told members about a                     
  former legislator who had managed a resort several years                     
  ago, who said the resort moved over one million pounds of                    
  fish on Alaska Airlines.                                                     
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR noted that people have been concerned about                   
  the large volume of fish leaving the state, which is why                     
  there is an amendment before the committee about the issue                   
  of allocation between resource gatherers.  He believed the                   
  alternative suggested is a good one and he does support the                  
  amendment.  However, he felt it could be a volatile issue                    
  and rather than lose SB 153 in the process, he hoped the                     
  committee might consider those issues and decide if they                     
  want to take on a fight on the floor over the allocation                     
  question.                                                                    
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR stated SB 153 began first as a jobs bill and                  
  second as a bill to get an estimate on the amount of fish                    
  leaving the state and determine how severe the problem is.                   
  He said once those two things are in hand, there will be a                   
  better basis for the third step, which is the amendment                      
  before the committee.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 125                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS asked Senator Taylor to explain the Letter                 
  of Intent attached to SB 153.                                                
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR responded the Letter of Intent accomplishes                   
  almost what the amendment does.  He said the Letter of                       
  Intent is a proposal suggesting that the issue of large                      
  amounts of fish leaving the state be reviewed.  However, the                 
  problem the Board of Fisheries will have is they do not have                 
  any numbers currently, only speculation.                                     
                                                                               
  Number 141                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE DAVID FINKELSTEIN noted at the last hearing                   
  on SB 153, he tried to determine whether or not the Board of                 
  Fisheries is allowed to enact regulations on possession                      
  limits.  He said the Letter of Intent implies that if the                    
  legislature asks the board to consider regulations on                        
  possession limits, they will do so if they think it is                       
  appropriate.  However, at the time of the last hearing on SB
  153, his understanding was it was not clear whether the                      
  board has the power to consider such regulations and the                     
  amendment will not require them to do so, but only allow                     
  them to do it.  He believed the Letter of Intent will not                    
  work, since it is not now allowed in present law.                            
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR felt it is allowed and noted that at the last                 
  Board of Fisheries meeting, the board changed the bag limit                  
  for most of Southeast Alaska to two trout per day.  He said                  
  if the board has the authority to do that, just through the                  
  possession limit alone, they could regulate the process.                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE FINKELSTEIN said the regulation is not viewed                 
  as covering possession of processed fish and noted that                      
  processed fish includes just frozen fish.                                    
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR felt the amendment is really a whole other                    
  bill and is a very volatile issue.  He pointed out that                      
  Deborah Lyons would be seated on the Board of Fisheries were                 
  it not for the current issue.  He felt the amendment turns                   
  the bill into a Deborah Lyons fight all over again.  Senator                 
  Taylor said the legislature, at some time, will need to                      
  address the issue.                                                           
                                                                               
  Number 188                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE CON BUNDE stated in Southcentral there is a                   
  yearly king salmon limit of five.  He said the board can                     
  really enact an ultimate possession limit by enacting a                      
  yearly limit.  He expressed concerns that possession limits                  
  are not addressing processed fish and if processing does not                 
  include canning, he is even more concerned.  He asked                        
  Senator Taylor if it was his intent in the bill not to                       
  include exchanging fish for canned.                                          
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR replied he did not think there were any                       
  restrictions on the processing.                                              
                                                                               
  (CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS noted for the record that REPRESENTATIVES                 
  JAMES AND MULDER joined the committee at 8:30 a.m.)                          
                                                                               
  SENATOR TAYLOR said the bill does not affect the current                     
  process used by fish charter operators.                                      
                                                                               
  Number 224                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BILL HUDSON noted that the original intent of                 
  SB 153 was to provide legally what is already being done                     
  illegally throughout the state.  He felt that setting limits                 
  on the amount of raw and processed fish taken in sport                       
  fishing is authorized under bag limits, harvest levels, etc.                 
  The difference in the amendment is in the transit area -                     
  moving poundage of fish out of the state.  He thought the                    
  transit requirement will be very difficult to administer.                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE commented they cannot predicate                         
  legislation based on scofflaws as they will always find a                    
  way around the law.  He believed the amendment will set the                  
  standard for law abiding people.                                             
                                                                               
  Number 274                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE GAIL PHILLIPS, expressed her support of the                   
  ideas in SB 153, but felt there are problems posed by the                    
  inclusion of the proposed K.3 amendment.  She felt the issue                 
  had been generated from controversy over king salmon                         
  problems existing primarily in Southeast Alaska.  Possession                 
  limits on processed sport caught fish has previously been                    
  proposed to the Board of Fisheries.  The issue was                           
  considered by the board and they declined to take action.                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS said while there is a minor amount                   
  of abuse in her Kenai Peninsula district, there is a sense                   
  of compliance with the reasonable harvest and use of the                     
  area's seafood resources.  The overall health of the fishery                 
  stocks there is good and there are season possession limits                  
  on king salmon which are subject to license marking                          
  requirements.  She pointed out that any questions on the                     
  enforceability of current regulations beg the question on                    
  how the state would even begin to address the enforcement of                 
  additional regulations on processed fish.                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS stressed that the situation in                       
  Southeast Alaska may well warrant attention.  However,                       
  inclusion of the remainder of the state under the blanket of                 
  the amendment is unwarranted.  She felt a public information                 
  campaign, elevating the importance of conservation and                       
  reasonable use, and more revenue resources in enforcement of                 
  existing regulations is needed to handle the abuse                           
  situation.  She urged committee members not to adopt the K.3                 
  amendment.                                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 316                                                                   
                                                                               
  LEE PUTNAM, VICE PRESIDENT, KETCHIKAN SPORTS AND WILDLIFE                    
  CLUB, testified via teleconference, and commented there is a                 
  need to restrict the number of fish taken out of state by                    
  nonresidents, especially when it causes residents the loss                   
  of opportunity to harvest the resource.  He said it is                       
  distressing to see a small, but organized vocal group of                     
  commercial resource exploiters forcing their way on the                      
  majority of the residents of Alaska.  He felt the K.3                        
  amendment will begin to address the problem of the rapidly                   
  expanding guided sport fishing industry and its negative                     
  impact on the local and personal use sport fishery which has                 
  had little or no growth in the past years.                                   
                                                                               
  MR. PUTNAM pointed out there are a number of small                           
  nonresident harvest and processing operations operating in                   
  several areas of the state, canning or freezing a large                      
  number of fish.  The Alaska Department of Fish and Game                      
  (ADF&G) usually ignores this (indiscernible) from Alaska's                   
  food resources.  ADF&G says the limit is unenforceable                       
  (indiscernible)...                                                           
                                                                               
  Number 356                                                                   
                                                                               
  GARY PLUMB, CHARTER OPERATOR, KETCHIKAN, testified via                       
  teleconference, and expressed his opposition to the proposed                 
  K.3 amendment.  He felt there is merit in the intent, but                    
  thought it will result in restricting the honest, law                        
  abiding citizen while the abusers continue to do what they                   
  have always done.                                                            
                                                                               
  Number 385                                                                   
                                                                               
  MATT DONOHOE, SITKA, testified via teleconference, and                       
  expressed his support of the K.3 amendment.                                  
                                                                               
  WAYNE CARPENTER, SEWARD CHARTER BOAT ASSOCIATION, testified                  
  via teleconference, and expressed his opposition to the                      
  proposed K.3 amendment.  He believed issues such as what is                  
  proposed in the amendment should be addressed on a regional                  
  basis.  He said he has been working with the North Pacific                   
  Fishery Management Council on potential regulation of the                    
  guided halibut charter sport fishing industry and they are                   
  finding that regulations are not needed in every area of the                 
  state.                                                                       
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS noted the amendment will not make the                      
  regulations statewide.  In the amendment, the Board of                       
  Fisheries has the option to establish limits wherever                        
  needed.                                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 427                                                                   
                                                                               
  THEODORE JOHNSON, SOLDOTNA, testified via teleconference,                    
  and expressed his opposition to the K.3 amendment.  He felt                  
  the amendment is another knee jerk reaction from the                         
  commercial fishing interests to an assumed problem of sport                  
  fishermen taking "their" fish.  He stressed the importance                   
  of enforcing present laws.  Mr. Johnson asked if fish will                   
  be regulated by poundage or numbers in the amendment.  He                    
  also wondered how Canada enforces their export limit.  He                    
  said seeing boxes of fish in the airport makes him happy as                  
  it means there are many sport fishermen in the state                         
  catching and shipping fish to their homes, which is great                    
  advertising for the state.                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS replied at the last hearing on SB 153,                     
  there was a person from the Department of Public Safety                      
  supporting the amendment.  On the question of controls, he                   
  felt most people are law abiding.  He said Canada has very                   
  tight exports on fish leaving the country.                                   
                                                                               
  MR. JOHNSON asked if the state currently has an export                       
  limit.                                                                       
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS replied it is against the law to control                   
  export limits within the United States.  He said possession                  
  limits for salmon in British Columbia tide waters are two                    
  single-day limits of fresh, smoked or frozen plus ten                        
  kilograms canned OR one day limit of fresh, smoked or                        
  frozen, plus 20 kilograms canned OR 40 kilograms canned.  He                 
  also noted that salmon and game fish taken from nontidal                     
  waters may be canned only at a person's ordinary residence.                  
                                                                               
  Number 524                                                                   
                                                                               
  PAUL GOEDERT, DEEP CREEK CHARTER BOAT ASSOCIATION,                           
  NINILCHIK, testified via teleconference, and said most                       
  people in Alaska have time to wait on their own fish.  Only                  
  those people on a tight schedule will be affected by SB 153.                 
  He felt a lot of time is being wasted on an unimportant                      
  bill.  He said the reason he came to speak on SB 153 is the                  
  K.3 amendment.  Mr. Goedert asked Chairman Williams,                         
  referring to the discussion on the large number of boxes of                  
  fish in the airport, if he would be so concerned if the                      
  boxes were filled with clothes made in Alaska, or coal, etc.                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  MR. GOEDERT stressed that tourism is a major industry in                     
  Alaska and sport fishing is a large part of that industry.                   
  Tourists taking fish home in boxes shows that the sport                      
  fishing guides are doing their jobs.  Each fish caught by a                  
  tourist represents approximately ten times as much cash as a                 
  commercially caught fish, plus the money is spread out more.                 
  He wondered how the K.3 amendment will be enforced.  For                     
  example, if a tourist is taking home four cases of canned                    
  halibut, how many 50 pound fish is that?  In regard to                       
  people coming to the state and taking home enough fish to                    
  pay for their trip, he pointed out that if a person has 50                   
  pounds of filet and at Carr's the same filets cost $5 a                      
  pound, that person has $250 worth of fish.                                   
                                                                               
  MR. GOEDERT recalled at the last hearing on SB 153,                          
  Representative Bunde talked about the coolers of fish he                     
  loaded and flew out as a bush pilot.  He asked                               
  Representative Bunde how much ice was in the cooler, how                     
  many people were involved and how long had they been                         
  fishing.  He felt the K.3 amendment was wasting a lot of                     
  people's time and arguments about curtailing fish exports is                 
  part of an agenda by the commercial fishing industry to                      
  hamper and limit the growth of the state's most important                    
  industry.                                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 586                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS responded the amendment was not brought to                 
  him by the commercial fishing industry.  He said he                          
  recognizes the great benefits and potential of the charter                   
  industry in Alaska and is convinced that the amendment can                   
  be helpful in promoting an orderly and sensible development                  
  of the industry while also protecting the resident sport                     
  fishermen.  He felt in the long run it will be good for                      
  everyone.                                                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE assured Mr. Goedert that he can tell                    
  the difference between ice and king filets.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 601                                                                   
                                                                               
  SEAN MARTIN, HOMER CHARTER ASSOCIATION, testified via                        
  teleconference, and said he would like to comment on the K.3                 
  amendment.  He felt the amendment came about as a result of                  
  complaints about large quantities of fish boxes in airports                  
  headed for outside the state and about people spending their                 
  summers in campgrounds canning fish and leaving the state                    
  with large quantities of sport caught fish.  He stated that                  
  over the years, the people he has witnessed are not taking                   
  more than their daily bag limits or season limits.  They may                 
  be taking more fish out of the state than a resident would                   
  probably use, but who is to say they will not use the fish                   
  as gifts.  He pointed out that millions of dollars are being                 
  left in the state by nonresidents.                                           
                                                                               
  MR. MARTIN stressed it costs a lot of money to get to Homer,                 
  go with a guide, get lodging, eat meals, etc., and if a                      
  person is able to pay for the trip by selling the fish they                  
  catch, they will have to sell the fish at $25 per pound in                   
  order to cover their expenses.  He reminded members it is                    
  against the law to sell sport caught fish and if they know                   
  it is being done, they should support the law and turn the                   
  offenders in.                                                                
                                                                               
  MR. MARTIN recalled at the last hearing, a legislator                        
  mentioned that a group of Germans were leaving the state                     
  with so many fish boxes they had to be selling the fish back                 
  home.  He felt statements like that should not be made by                    
  anyone without facts.  Those people could have purchased the                 
  fish.  He wondered if the K.3 amendment passes, what will                    
  happen at airports and the borders when an inspector tries                   
  to determine how much fish was legally caught and how much                   
  was bought.  If there is a restriction on the amount of                      
  sport fish taken out of the state, he asked if there is also                 
  going to be a restriction on the amount a person can buy to                  
  take out of the state.                                                       
                                                                               
  MR. MARTIN stated the amount of fish leaving the state is                    
  only a reflection of the number of anglers coming into the                   
  state, and stressed there will be vast quantities of fish                    
  leaving as how else will the fish get out.  He felt it is a                  
  perception problem not a fishery problem.  If taking too                     
  many fish are depleting a fishery then it needs to be                        
  managed biologically using the means currently in place.                     
  The International Pacific Halibut Commission, the North                      
  Pacific Fishery Management Council, ADF&G and the National                   
  Marine Fishery Service are charged with proper management of                 
  the fisheries resource and they should close the fishery,                    
  shorten the seasons, reduce bag limits or reallocate the                     
  fish to a cleaner fishery.                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. MARTIN said at the present time, it is allowable for                     
  Oregon and Washington commercial longline boats to remove                    
  from Alaskan waters as much halibut as their holds or trips                  
  limits will allow and take the fish outside the state and                    
  sell it.  He wondered why a sport angler should only be                      
  allowed to take out of state what is determined to be the                    
  proper amount.  He commented if there is a concern about the                 
  health of the resource, then attention should be given to                    
  the by-catch, wastage and over fishing done by commercial                    
  fishermen.  He felt their fisheries should be cleaned up                     
  first and if there still is a biological reason to restrict                  
  sport anglers, it should be done using the tools already in                  
  place.                                                                       
                                                                               
  MR. MARTIN stated the Homer Charter Association is opposed                   
  to the K.3 amendment and feels it is politically motivated                   
  by commercial fishing interests, who believe that any                        
  restrictions placed on sport fishermen means more fish for                   
  them.  He felt in the long term, it may be that per pound a                  
  sport caught fish is far more valuable than a commercially                   
  caught one.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 709                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS commented that the difference between                      
  processed sport caught fish and commercial processed fish,                   
  is the commercial processed fish is labeled.                                 
                                                                               
  DENNIS PEIRE, VALDEZ CHARTER ASSOCIATION, testified via                      
  teleconference, and said last year he did not get any salmon                 
  because of the interception by a commercial fleet.  He                       
  wondered how people from Fairbanks are going to get their                    
  fish back home from Southeast Alaska without being labeled                   
  as going out of state.  He stated the association feels it                   
  is an allocation issue and the resources should be equally                   
  divided between all three groups - sport, commercial, and                    
  subsistence.  Mr. Peire also thought that personal use fish                  
  should be classified as subsistence.                                         
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-12, SIDE B                                                           
  Number 000                                                                   
                                                                               
  BUZZ OTIS, FAIRBANKS, testified via teleconference, and                      
  stated the K.3 amendment is discriminatory to Interior                       
  Alaska fishermen.  He said they do not have the luxury of                    
  fishing on a weekly basis, but rather take short trips south                 
  to fish.  He noted that if he catches fish, takes them back,                 
  cleans them and puts them in the freezer and the third day                   
  he goes out, and brings fish back to Fairbanks, he is a                      
  criminal according to the amendment.  He expressed his                       
  opposition to the K.3 amendment and encouraged the committee                 
  not to discriminate against fellow Alaskans.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 025                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE said, as he reads the amendment, he                     
  cannot find language which sets a specific possession limit                  
  at this point.  It says the Board of Fisheries may set a                     
  limit.                                                                       
                                                                               
  MR. OTIS responded it gives the board the vehicle to do so.                  
  Once the board has the authority, the legislature and the                    
  sport fishermen have no control over it.  Many times the                     
  board makes rules according to perceived abuse and that                      
  concerns him.                                                                
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE commented that currently there are                      
  different king salmon limits in Southcentral and Southeast.                  
  He said he encourages the department to write rules which                    
  are specific to geographic regions.                                          
                                                                               
  Number 046                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON remarked the K.3 amendment permits the                 
  board to not only set limits on the amount of raw and                        
  processed fish taken, but also possession in the field and                   
  in transit to a fisherman's permanent place of residence.                    
  He expressed concern that a person coming to Juneau from                     
  Fairbanks, who catches fish, whatever limit is set for                       
  nonresidents, will have to apply to residents also.                          
                                                                               
  RICHARD ANDREW, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference, and                 
  expressed his support of the K.3 amendment.  He said why                     
  wait until the resource has problems before something is                     
  done.                                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 068                                                                   
                                                                               
  ROBERT HUGHES, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference, and                  
  commented that everyone refuses to acknowledge the fact that                 
  the visitor industry has gone out of control.  The resource                  
  needs protection and the commercial, sport and subsistence                   
  fisheries should not be penalized when another group is out                  
  of control.  He said the amendment is the first thing to                     
  come along which may address the problem.  He expressed his                  
  full support of SB 153 and the K.3 amendment.                                
                                                                               
  DAVID BRAY, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference, and                     
  expressed his support of the K.3 amendment.  It will give a                  
  good record of fish going out of the state.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 100                                                                   
                                                                               
  ERIC MUENCH, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference, and                    
  said he supports the K.3 amendment.  He felt the amendment                   
  will help address ongoing abuse and stressed the problem is                  
  the nonresident guided sport fishery, which is a part of the                 
  general expansion of the tourism industry, a highly                          
  consumptive industry.  He emphasized he does not have any                    
  problem with the guiding of nonresident sport fishermen, but                 
  there has to be a realization that there is a limited                        
  resource and it cannot be bonded to tourists.                                
                                                                               
  MR. MUENCH remarked the number of tourists coming to the                     
  state to fish, even on a one-time basis, can easily                          
  overwhelm the local and state population and crowd out local                 
  fishermen, impacting the catch limit in the future.                          
  Tourists are in direct competition with resident sport                       
  fishermen.  He felt another problem is the loophole saying a                 
  frozen fish is a processed fish as the big charter boats                     
  carry large freezer components which the small, local                        
  fishermen cannot do.  That loophole needs to be plugged.                     
                                                                               
  Number 132                                                                   
                                                                               
  DEAN PADDOCK, JUNEAU, stated he felt the issue at hand is a                  
  conservation problem and thought many of the expressions he                  
  had been hearing are not applicable to where the problem                     
  originates.  He expressed support of the K.3 amendment and                   
  felt it is a tool that the Board of Fisheries needs to use                   
  where called for, and a tool they do not have to use it if                   
  it is not called for.  He stressed it is a complex problem                   
  and varies from area to area in the state and species by                     
  species.  He felt the board really needs help from the                       
  legislature.                                                                 
                                                                               
  MR. PADDOCK felt the issue is a natural outgrowth of the                     
  increasing demand by an increasing number of people.  He                     
  talked about situations 35 years ago relating to large                       
  numbers of fish boxes in airports.  He felt the concern                      
  expressed by many people is a valid concern and again                        
  expressed support for the K.3 amendment.                                     
                                                                               
  Number 209                                                                   
                                                                               
  RICHARD HOFMANN, JUNEAU, told members he is a commercial                     
  fisherman and sport fisherman.  He said there has been talk                  
  about enforcing the K.3 amendment and explained enforcement                  
  of the ADF&G rules in the guided industry are the                            
  responsibility of the guide.  He stressed there is a benefit                 
  to the K.3 amendment and limiting the number of fish an                      
  individual can harvest, in that it will spread the catch                     
  over a larger number of clients, providing for growth in the                 
  charter industry since more people will be serviced.                         
                                                                               
  MR. HOFMANN noted there has been comments the commercial                     
  fleet is out to get more fish and said he is only asking                     
  that the status quo be maintained so that everyone has the                   
  opportunity to continue their livelihoods.  He pointed out                   
  that trollers were told to go to the Board of Fisheries                      
  meeting with a plan on how to regulate the fisheries on a                    
  long term, based on an allocation which was established.                     
  Upon arriving at the meeting, the allocation had been                        
  changed.  He said without control over the number of sport                   
  fish harvested, there will be a demand to change the                         
  allocation.                                                                  
                                                                               
  MR. HOFMANN said there has been talk about commercial                        
  fishermen needing to clean up their fishery.   Through                       
  management regulations, individual conservation concerns and                 
  a desire to continue to fish for many years, the fishery has                 
  been cleaned up.  He agreed that the people in the Interior                  
  might be negatively impacted by the amendment, but felt                      
  where a person lives is a personal choice.  He said he has                   
  limited his opportunity to harvest moose, caribou, etc., by                  
  living in Southeast Alaska.                                                  
                                                                               
  MR. HOFMANN remarked that if a special consideration is made                 
  to ensure that Interior residents have access to resources                   
  in Southeast, then a special harvest opportunity should be                   
  established for those who live in Southeast who want to                      
  utilize food resources which come out of the Interior.  He                   
  urged committee members to adopt the K.3 amendment and felt                  
  the concept behind the original bill to get more value-added                 
  processing in the state is a good idea but will also create                  
  problems for the resource if it is done without the                          
  amendment.                                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 275                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked Mr. HofMann if he thought                        
  residents can be treated differently than nonresidents in                    
  regard to quotas, daily bag limits, number of fish shipped                   
  out, etc.                                                                    
                                                                               
  MR. HOFMANN responded no, as it is unconstitutional.                         
                                                                               
  Number 290                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON expressed his concern regarding how                    
  the provisions of the amendment can be accomplished without                  
  penalizing a fisherman coming from the Interior.  He                         
  wondered if perhaps it would be possible to have some sort                   
  of certification of the number of days fished, the areas                     
  fished, the total number of fish by species taken, the                       
  number of fish shipped if processed within the state, the                    
  license number of the processor and the fish exchange.  That                 
  kind of certification could help give the statistical                        
  information needed.  If a nonresident is given a license and                 
  a certification form, the meat hunters will be alerted they                  
  will be watched.                                                             
                                                                               
  Number 320                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. HOFMANN responded there will be an accounting developed                  
  through the raw fish exchange and through the guided                         
  industry keeping track.                                                      
                                                                               
  ROBERT WARD, A-WARD CHARTERS, ANCHOR POINT, testifying via                   
  teleconference, felt the problem is not a biological, but                    
  rather an allocation problem.  He expressed his unhappiness                  
  about the meeting process, who had been allowed to testify                   
  and felt the teleconference was biased toward Southeast                      
  Alaska.  He pointed out that an Attorney General's decision                  
  was passed out a couple of years ago to a fish processor                     
  because when fish is weighed it comes in as raw fish and                     
  then it changes weight, size and shape, providing no                         
  accountability between it being checked in and checked out                   
  of that processor.                                                           
                                                                               
  MR. WARD expressed opposition to the K.3 amendment and did                   
  not feel SB 153 is a jobs enhancement idea, as there will                    
  not be a greater demand.  He also expressed concerns about                   
  the quality of the product when fish are brought in.  He                     
  felt the entire issue is a presumed problem and that the                     
  sport fish industry is under control.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 392                                                                   
                                                                               
  JOE AMBROSE, AIDE, SENATOR ROBIN TAYLOR, told Mr. Ward that                  
  the quality issue was addressed in SB 153 as DEC will have                   
  oversight over the processors as they do now, and every                      
  consideration will be given to the quality of the product;                   
  both the product received by the processor and the product                   
  provided by the processor to the consumer.  In regard to                     
  sport fishing entering the commercial market at the end of                   
  the cycle, the bill provides that after the first round of                   
  exchange, the processor must use sport caught for sport                      
  caught at the end of the cycle and anything left over has to                 
  be donated to charity. It cannot be sold.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 413                                                                   
                                                                               
  TOM HAGBORG, MEMBER, SOUTH PENINSULA SPORTSMENS ASSOCIATION,                 
  ANCHOR POINT, testifying via teleconference, expressed                       
  opposition to the K.3 amendment.  He agreed there are                        
  millions of pounds of fish going out of the state in boxes                   
  every year and it is called commercial fishing.  He stressed                 
  sport fishermen catch less than five percent of the total                    
  catch.  Limits have been set to sustain biological fish                      
  catches which protect fish stocks.  He reminded committee                    
  members that nonresident fishing licenses support the fish                   
  hatcheries in the state and a large amount of money is                       
  received from the licenses.                                                  
                                                                               
  MR. HAGBORG felt it would be difficult for nonresidents to                   
  pay for their fishing trips to Alaska with fish caught as                    
  the price being paid for fish is very low.  He said the                      
  association opposes the K.3 amendment and has questions                      
  regarding SB 153.  He urged members to allow the Board of                    
  Fisheries to set biological limits to protect fish stocks.                   
                                                                               
  NANCY HILLSTRAND, OWNER/OPERATOR, COAL POINT TRADING                         
  COMPANY, HOMER, testified via teleconference, and said her                   
  company is a custom processor for sport and commercially                     
  caught fish.  She expressed opposition to the K.3 amendment                  
  and felt the perceived problem can be more efficiently and                   
  effectively addressed by the Board of Fisheries.  However,                   
  she thought it was a moot point, as the amendment cannot be                  
  enforced.  She also wondered why it was being considered                     
  when there is a by-catch of 50 percent of trollers catch,                    
  hundreds of millions of pounds, being thrown overboard.                      
  Billions of pounds of fish are being shipped overseas as an                  
  export.                                                                      
                                                                               
  MS. HILLSTRAND stated in regard to SB 153 and exchanging                     
  fish, in her company, they refuse to exchange any fish                       
  because of the quality of the fish coming into their                         
  company.  She did not believe leftover fish will be given to                 
  charities, but rather it will get sold.  She pointed out                     
  that her company puts forth a lot of effort to ensure a                      
  quality product and they do not want sport caught fish on                    
  the market.                                                                  
                                                                               
  RICK CONOVER, PRESIDENT, ANCHOR POINT CHAMBER OF COMMERCE,                   
  testifying via teleconference, advised that the Board of                     
  Directors unanimously voted to oppose the K.3 amendment.                     
  Tourism is the key industry in Anchor Point and the chamber                  
  feels the amendment will adversely affect their only                         
  industry.  He said there is still plenty of room in Anchor                   
  Point for growth in the tourism industry.  The main                          
  attraction for tourism is sport fishing in the Anchor River                  
  and the lower Cook Inlet.  Putting any limits on how much                    
  fish can be taken home will have an immediate, negative                      
  impact on Anchor Point's business community.  He stated it                   
  is a fact that the sport fish harvested and exported is not                  
  affecting the resource.                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 525                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. CONOVER stated the chamber feels saddened that both                      
  sport and commercial fishermen are using the legislature to                  
  try and allocate this renewable resource.  He felt the                       
  legislature should not be involved in any resource                           
  allocations.  The people in Anchor Point feel if the K.3                     
  amendment passes, it is the beginning of the end of their                    
  tourism resource and the current legislature will always be                  
  remembered as the legislature that wiped out tourist                         
  fishermen and associated businesses.  He said it must be                     
  remembered that the state's resources are not only for                       
  Alaskan residents, but for all U.S. residents.  Any bills                    
  dealing with allocation of resources by the legislature,                     
  such as the amendment before the committee, should be                        
  killed.  There is no biological data to support the                          
  amendment.                                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 545                                                                   
                                                                               
  DARREL SHREVE, VALDEZ CHARTER ASSOCIATION, testified via                     
  teleconference, and said the issue at hand is a regional                     
  one.  He felt decisions should only be made after there is a                 
  handle on the problem.  He expressed opposition to the K.3                   
  amendment.                                                                   
                                                                               
  DONALD WESTLUND, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference,                    
  and pointed out that the comment made earlier regarding                      
  sport fishermen catch being five percent is wrong; sport                     
  fishermen catch less than two percent and includes                           
  subsistence, sport and personal use.  Eighty percent of                      
  salmon caught in Alaska is caught by commercial fishermen.                   
  He expressed his opposition to SB 153 and the K.3 amendment,                 
  and felt the amendment is unconstitutional because there can                 
  be no differentiation between residents and nonresidents.                    
  Since the sport, subsistence and personal use fishery only                   
  catch two percent, a higher percentage of fish should be                     
  given to those fisheries instead of the commercial                           
  fisheries.                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. WESTLUND wondered if the boxes at the airport belong to                  
  commercial fishermen going home, taking commercially caught                  
  fish which is unreported, unaccounted, etc.  He felt the                     
  legislature should not be involved in allocation issues.                     
                                                                               
  Number 622                                                                   
                                                                               
  ED STAHL, CHARTER BOAT OPERATOR, HAND TROLLER AND SPORT                      
  FISHERMEN, testified via teleconference, and stated there is                 
  a problem with people setting up small-time canning                          
  operations and the bill should address them.                                 
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS said there are committee members who need                  
  to leave the meeting.  He suggested the committee talk about                 
  the bill as his intention is to move it out of committee.                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE noted that although he is neutral on SB
  153 and the K.3 amendment, he had not been lobbied by a                      
  single commercial fisherman on the bill.  The only testimony                 
  he had heard from commercial fishermen had been in the                       
  committee room.  He said he did not see a great juggernaut                   
  of commercial fishing pressure pushing the bill.                             
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE stated he is concerned about equal                      
  access to the state's fishing resource.  Contrary to the                     
  comment made earlier about the resource belonging to the                     
  United States, he believes the fish resource belongs to the                  
  people of Alaska, just like the oil resource.  A person who                  
  has chosen to sell fish as a charter boat skipper, does not                  
  have any more right to the fish just because they are                        
  involved in a commercial enterprise, just as commercial                      
  fishermen do not have any more right.  He felt if all the                    
  people lobbying legislators on the Kenai River reds have to                  
  choose between nonresidents taking fish out of the state,                    
  sold to them by charter boat skippers, and the personal                      
  right to catch "their" fish, the charter boat skippers are                   
  going to get left behind.                                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE believed the charter boat operators                     
  might be doing themselves a disservice by so adamantly                       
  opposing a possession limit on processed fish.  If a person                  
  has to choose between catching a few reds once or twice a                    
  year and somebody coming to the state, camping for the                       
  summer, loading up their motor home with fish or the person                  
  who is on vacation who can spend the time and money to go                    
  out with a charter skipper compared to the guy just fishing                  
  out of his skiff, the charter people are going to lose.  He                  
  said they should be proactive and prevent the perception                     
  from occurring.  He would like to see an accounting on the                   
  amount of fish being exchanged and either moved around the                   
  state or out of state.  It may be an insignificant amount                    
  which will be a comfort to the charter people.  On the other                 
  hand, it might be a significant amount and choices will need                 
  to be made.                                                                  
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-13, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 000                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS said he did not want to hold up SB 153 if                  
  it has to be fought all the way through because of the                       
  amendment.  He felt the Letter Of Intent will begin working                  
  on the limit issue.                                                          
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON stated the K.3 amendment, by making it                 
  subject to the discretion of the Board of Fisheries to adopt                 
  regulations concerning limits, amounts, field possession,                    
  and transit amounts is essentially the same thing as the                     
  Letter of Intent.  It leaves it up to the board in both                      
  instances and because of what has been heard across the                      
  state, particularly in regard to regional differences, he                    
  felt the original bill with the Letter of Intent is the                      
  right way to go.  He recommended the committee consider                      
  that.                                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 020                                                                   
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS suggested the committee listen to more                     
  testimony on teleconference.                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 022                                                                   
                                                                               
  SCOTT ULMER, HOMER, testified via teleconference, and                        
  expressed his opposition to SB 153 and the K.3 amendment.                    
  He felt the bill will provide a situation which reduces the                  
  quality of the product in the state as there will be no                      
  control over the quality of fish coming in and therefore,                    
  there will be no control over the quality of the fish going                  
  out.  Most anglers coming into the state are quite concerned                 
  about the quality of their fish and want to make sure it is                  
  cared for properly, and therefore will not consider                          
  exchanging their fish for a lower quality fish.  He stated                   
  quality will be very difficult to enforce as a DEC agent                     
  will have to be present at each and every processor in the                   
  state.                                                                       
                                                                               
  MR. ULMER felt the K.3 amendment is an allocation issue and                  
  the prime agenda of the bill is not jobs enhancement, but                    
  rather trying to get a handle on the volume of the product                   
  moving out of the state in the sport industry.  He pointed                   
  out that the percentage of sport caught fish is an                           
  insignificant percentage of the resource in the state.                       
                                                                               
  Number 055                                                                   
                                                                               
  NOEL PUTNAM, KETCHIKAN, testified via teleconference, and                    
  expressed his support of the K.3 amendment.                                  
                                                                               
  JOE SUYMBERSKY, FRITZ CREEK, testified via teleconference,                   
  and expressed his opposition to SB 153 and the K.3                           
  amendment.  He believed there are no biological reasons for                  
  the bill and does not think it is enforceable.  He felt the                  
  fish belong to everyone, as they are a public resource and                   
  the public is everyone in the United States.                                 
                                                                               
  ED DERSHAM, ANCHOR POINT, testified via teleconference, and                  
  told committee members he had sent his written comments to                   
  the committee.  He said he was extremely disappointed in the                 
  way the meeting  and the previous meeting had been run and                   
  who had been allowed to testify.  He felt the people in                      
  Homer had not been treated fairly in the amount of time they                 
  had received to testify.                                                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE MULDER disagreed with Mr. Dersham and said                    
  the Chairman has been fair in running the meeting.                           
                                                                               
  Number 100                                                                   
                                                                               
  ROGER WATNEY, ANCHOR POINT, testified via teleconference,                    
  and expressed his reservations about SB 153 and opposition                   
  to the K.3 amendment.  He stated SB 153 has merit, but felt                  
  the exchange of fish will be very difficult to regulate.                     
  The people he takes out fishing enjoy taking home a fish                     
  they personally caught, which was carefully bled, cleaned                    
  and chilled.  He felt the state's diminishing money should                   
  be used more wisely, not on unnecessary regulations.  He                     
  remarked the K.3 amendment is a back door way to use the                     
  Board of Fisheries to allocate more fish away from the sport                 
  fisherman.                                                                   
                                                                               
  KARAN DERSHAM, ANCHOR POINT, testified via teleconference,                   
  and said she would pass, as everything she wanted to say has                 
  been said.                                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 117                                                                   
                                                                               
  JACK MONTGOMERY, OWNER/OPERATOR, RAINBOW TOURS, HOMER,                       
  testified via teleconference, and asked to read a letter                     
  from Gregory McIntosh, McIntosh Marinas, Halibut Cove.  "I                   
  continue to support SB 153 for reasons previously stated;                    
  namely the bill will assist in protecting public health                      
  (indiscernible) caught fish will not be bartered or sold or                  
  otherwise enter into (indiscernible).  It will provide a                     
  mechanism for distributing uncollected and otherwise                         
  abandoned recreational caught fish and seafood products.                     
                                                                               
  "I oppose the K.3 amendment.  The amendment seeks to                         
  establish a framework whereby additional restrictions on                     
  possession of recreational caught fish may be inaccurate at                  
  some future date.  Constraining export of legally caught                     
  fish by means of state (indiscernible) laws may not be                       
  consistent with the Magnuson Act and therefore is                            
  unenforceable.  The amendment is also impractical.  What is                  
  to prevent a fisherman from shipping a load of fish product                  
  out of state once the new possession limit is reached.                       
  Within 24 hours the product will have reached its                            
  destination home and the fisherman can start all over again,                 
  thus circumventing the intent of the proposed amendment.                     
  Existing recreational bag and possession limits are doing a                  
  good job protecting the resource while at the same time                      
  allowing (indiscernible) access and opportunity to it.                       
                                                                               
  "Restrictions will have a dramatic effect upon outside                       
  Anchorage participation in Alaska's fisheries.  Any                          
  reduction of angler activity will negatively impact Alaska's                 
  economy.  Recreational fishing contributed over $580 million                 
  in the Alaska economy in 1991.  ...(indiscernible) dollar                    
  values attributed to commercial fishing, recreational                        
  fishing dollars stayed in Alaska.  If Representative                         
  Williams is concerned about commercial traffic of fish and                   
  fish products outside of Alaska which would violate existing                 
  Alaska statute, he need only to look at the (indiscernible)                  
  Act for comfort.  I highly suggest they look into that.                      
  Clearly, the amendment is proposed for reasons other than                    
  responsible conservation management and protection of the                    
  Alaska fisheries resource.  The proposed amendment is                        
  insupportable.  Summarized, the K-3 amendment is                             
  unnecessary, unenforceable and economically damaging to the                  
  state of Alaska."  Mr. Montgomery also expressed his                         
  opposition to SB 153 and the K.3 amendment.                                  
                                                                               
  DAN MCQUEEN, KETCHIKAN MARINE CHARTERS, INC., testified via                  
  teleconference, and expressed opposition to SB 153 and the                   
  K.3 amendment.  He stated the bill is a back door attempt to                 
  place export limits on nonresident and out of area resident                  
  sport fishermen.  The cover letter mentions that the K.3                     
  amendment will alleviate the many boxes of fish at airports.                 
  He disagreed because in December, when no sport fishing is                   
  occurring, he saw six full pallets of fish boxes leaving                     
  Sitka alone.                                                                 
                                                                               
  MR. MCQUEEN said recently Mary McDowell called and told him                  
  that Ketchikan Marine Charters, in its position paper,                       
  supported an export limit.  He clarified that what the                       
  position paper says is, they would like to see a task force                  
  of industry representatives formed to work on the issue.                     
  Ketchikan Marine Charters believes the original bill will                    
  benefit the state, but they oppose the bill if it includes                   
  the K.3 amendment.                                                           
                                                                               
  MR. MCQUEEN asked why Alaska resident sport fishermen should                 
  be restricted any further than they already are.  Many                       
  Alaskans do not have any other means of catching their                       
  winter supply of fish, so those Alaskans choose to spend 7-                  
  10 days fishing on a charter boat or rent a skiff for that                   
  time period.  He felt if the state truly wants to swap the                   
  people who do abuse the current regulations, the state                       
  should only offer two week nonresident fishing licenses.                     
  That way a person would not be able to come to the state and                 
  fish every day all summer long.  This bill will hurt many                    
  honest resident and nonresident sport fishermen but most                     
  important, it will cost more than it is worth to enforce.                    
                                                                               
  GERALD MASOLINI, CORDOVA, testified via teleconference, and                  
  said it appears there is a regional problem at hand.  He                     
  felt there was also an enforcement problem.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 222                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE FINKELSTEIN asked whether ADF&G views the                     
  existing law as allowing possession limits on processed                      
  products.  Does the Letter of Intent ask the department to                   
  do something they do not have the power to do.                               
                                                                               
  JOHN BURKE, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF SPORT FISH, ALASKA                  
  DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME, replied once fish is processed,                 
  it is beyond possession limits.                                              
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to MOVE CSSB 153(RES)am                  
  with the Senate Letter of Intent and two fiscal notes out                    
  with INDIVIDUAL RECOMMENDATIONS.                                             
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE MULDER OBJECTED for purpose of discussion.                    
  He clarified the committee is not adopting the K.3                           
  amendment, but is only moving CSSB 153(RES)am out of                         
  committee.  He WITHDREW his OBJECTION.                                       
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE FINKELSTEIN noted for the record that the                     
  representatives from ADF&G have told the committee the                       
  Senate Letter of Intent is ineffective and is based on                       
  presumption.                                                                 
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said the Letter of Intent is                           
  legislative intent language to the Board of Fisheries who he                 
  believes has the authority.                                                  
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE FINKELSTEIN stated the problem is he has been                 
  trying to get an answer during both meetings on this bill                    
  and he felt funny passing a Letter of Intent which asks the                  
  Board of Fisheries to do something they do not have the                      
  power to do.  He added, in making the decision not to adopt                  
  the K.3 amendment, the committee has decided not to give the                 
  board that power.                                                            
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON said he stands corrected, as staff                     
  told him the board does not have the power and therefore,                    
  the Letter of Intent will have no effect.                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE FINKELSTEIN suggested the committee just pass                 
  the bill since there is uncertainty on the Letter of Intent                  
  or handle the Letter of Intent separately from the bill.                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON WITHDREW his MOTION.                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to MOVE CSSB 153(RES)am                  
  with two fiscal notes from committee with INDIVIDUAL                         
  RECOMMENDATIONS.                                                             
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS asked if there were any objections to the                  
  motion.                                                                      
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE said he did not object, but commented                   
  it would have been more productive if the K.3 amendment had                  
  also been passed.                                                            
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS hearing no objections, said the MOTION                     
  PASSED.                                                                      
                                                                               
  ANNOUNCEMENTS                                                                
                                                                               
  CHAIRMAN WILLIAMS announced the committee will meet Monday,                  
  February 14 to take up SJR 40 and HB 306.                                    
                                                                               
  ADJOURNMENT                                                                  
                                                                               
  There being no further business to come before the House                     
  Resources Committee, Chairman Williams adjourned the meeting                 
  at 10:15 a.m.                                                                

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